Moving People Downtown - With the fears that have been expressed that downtown densities will bring more traffic congestion, it's a good time to talk about alternative ways to move people around downtown without their cars. Out there in the world there are a lot of really interesting alternatives; electric shuttles, racks of free bicycles (pick it up from a rack where you are, leave it on a rack where you're going,) moving sidewalks, all sorts of mini-trains or trolleys, and more traditional methods as well. How about an overhead gondola running from Hollywood 20, to Five Points, to Marina Jacks, out to St. Armand's Circle, and back. I know, it sounds crazy. But at one time powered flight sounded crazy too.
So - what are your ideas, or what have you seen out there in the rest of the world that you think might work in Sarasota? And for this stage of the game, lets leave out the part where we pick apart the ideas and find all of the reasons why they would never work - let's just focus on the possibilities. What do you think, no matter how crazy it might seem to us now?
So - what are your ideas, or what have you seen out there in the rest of the world that you think might work in Sarasota? And for this stage of the game, lets leave out the part where we pick apart the ideas and find all of the reasons why they would never work - let's just focus on the possibilities. What do you think, no matter how crazy it might seem to us now?
posted by Michael McNees at 4:48 PM
49 Comments:
"Beam me up, Scotty!!"
Mike,
I saw a really cool concept when I was in Norway several years ago. Their problem wasn't congestion, it was the climate. In winter it was too cold to start many of the vehicles, and they were likely buried in snow anyways. Also it was too cold to walk along their downtown for long distances.
Their solution was these little trolley-like buggies. Now this is not the big trolley that Sarasota had, these were like long golf carts that held maybe twelve or so persons - six on one side and six on the other with everyone looking outward. They were everywhere and were operated like a cross between a cab and a bus. You hopped on whenever one came by with an empty seat, and simple dropped a coin in the driver's box. I don't think there was even a set price it was more of a tip. When you wanted to get off you just told the guy to stop and you jumped. They had to be cheap to buy and operate, they were quite, clean, and energy efficient. They were also small, considering the large number of persons they could carry, and because they had a good number of them, it was extremely efficient. Some livery company could jump on that project if the City blessed off on the concept. Individual operators could make some serious tip money and could easily offset the cost of the vehicle and insurances. The speed limit on Main would also be conducive to such a conveyance.
First some comments. New Urbanists such as Duany are not creators of sustainable communities but there is some basis to start from in their designs. Sarasota still is not defined as far as its true plan. Will most people working in the City live there? Will it have its "centeredness" and will the urban core be conducive to less vehicular traffic or is less vehiclular traffic simply a result of unavailable parking and congestion? How about a test, say for a month where the community gets involved.
Maybe, if there is room, those poeple who sign up can park at various commuter lots throughout the County. Then,through private and public contributions, either in the form of SCAT providing shuttles free of charge, or businesses providing lunches for those daily commuters, surveys are conducted at the end of the month to see what opinions there are as to if this would be a viable alternative to bringing a vehicle into the City.
Shawn's idea is great as are pedicabs. I think, however, that that may be more of a weekend option at the present time. So, can you designate a few streets on a special weekend during this promotional month to be "car free?"
What about the possibility of trying water taxis. Could a provisional certificate be provided to a company willing to participate in a month long alternative transportation event and provide shuttle commuter service by water, say from different areas in the County, or even City Island to the City and St.Armand's.
What about contacting some alternative fuel vehicle manufacturer's and getting them involved in performing free taxi service around the City for a month. Perhaps combining alternative transportation with alternative fuels could lead to the option of free parking for those owners of altenatively fueled vehicles. If the present cab companies complain then let them offer some free services as well.
Raising parking rates is always a deterrent.
IF Bike lanes are not available then consider during this special moth of creating Bike days, electric bikes, inline skates, etc and consider rerouting traffic or creating one-way corridors so that those not in a vehicle can safely make their way to their jobs or homes.
What about lobbying the insurance industry for a "pay as you go" premium.
Let's face it, poeple like the accessibility to their vehicles. They may be waiting in traffic but they feel in control. Scheduling for commuters has to be consistent and efficient.
I think the City's ultimate direction needs more definition. If there is not a balance between the residential,entertainment, commerical and retail venues then the strength of the core or its "centeredness" will remain unbalanced and the need for vehicles will remain.
Camarogrl77
Mike, you were a big cheese in Collier County, right? Maybe you should take a look at what folks are saying there now. The Naples Daily News is taking a hack at affordable housing, and one of the pieces is, does it cost too much to live here? The blog under the story is an endless wail of despair. But you’ve moved on. Sarasota, watch out!
http://www.naplesnews.com/news/2006/mar/14/does_it_cost_too_much_live_here/?local_news
The problem is not congestion, but laziness,,,,I never have a problem finding a parking spot when im downtown. Yes we could use one or two more public lots but this is not the major problem it appears to be. And all the developers know how to pull the commishs'chain. "just offer parking and the project goes through"
I worked for ten years in New York City. Twice each day, I traversed the equivalent of three Sarasota "core downtown" areas to get from my train to my office. I used a very old and reliable biped mode of transportation...it's called "walking". Worked great. Keeps you in shape. What a bunch of wimps. No wonder our children are overweight and out of breath.
This is what is wrong with this city. Always acting like Sarasota has some unique issue when, in reality, you're just a little hick town in southwest Florida.
You know why I rode that train 80 miles and walked the 2 mile each day? No "affordable housing" in New York City. I lived in Pennsylvania and commuted. I made a free choice and then I did what I had to do. I didn't ask the city, county or state to help me out.
Grow up. You all act like a bunch of spoiled little brats.
Mr. McNees, I was wondering if you had a chance to read today's paper. Specifically, the article about Sgt. Gorevan being involved in the beating of an innocent area homeless guy? Very interesting read. It still amazes me that you found it necessary to delete/censor my blog, the one where I told you about Sgt. Gorevan's past and that he was lucky to still have a job at SPD. It entailed him following/stalking his reporter girlfriend in the County in a patrol car that is paid for with City taxpayer money and doing it on City taxpayers time. I also find it amusing that you censored that blog because one of your officers was being shown in a bad (but truthful) light, but you are more than happy to let everyone trash Ms. Chapman, one of your adversaries. I cut and pasted the blogs I'm referencing below just to refresh your memory and I've also sent it to the SHT reporter, Todd Ruger, and Tom Lyons. Maybe they'll find it worthwhile that you have an officer that was dumb enough to write a letter to the editor showing his bias against the homeless, alcohol and drug addicts, and then go so far as to beat one up. I wonder what would happen if I wrote something to the paper and then acted upon it? I'll bet the police would be wanting to talk to me? You need to get a handle on your police force. They're out of line.
Michael McNees wrote: Notice of Comment Editing! I have for the first time deleted one of the (non-spam) posted comments on this blog. A personal attack was made on a city employee, and that's not what this blog is about. (Unless of course someone attacks me, in which case I always leave those posted.) If someone wants to challenge that employees's point of view on an issue, that is welcomed, but since I make the rules here, that kind of personal attack is out.
18/1/06 11:02 AM
Note - the previous post contained a cut-and-paste reprint of a number of posts that appeared under the heading "Blog-Police Action" that was reprinted also. I have removed those, they are available on the blog already and are just taking up space by being repeated.
MIKE:
can you move the comments that do not have to do with mobility to another area? it is irritating to have to read past huge amounts of comments that are not about the current subject. It is also irritating to read about an employee knocking another employee without going through the property channels if they have a complaint. I hardly doubt the CHIEF does not know his officers pros and cons and deals with them as necessary. It is easy for those that stand on the side to throw comments.
The most effective transportation I have ever seen in cities is the smaller transporters that are located everywhere such as pedicabs, rickshaws, golf carts, small cabs - things like this. Many people that live and work downtown would use this type of transportation, even if you could call and get one in a timely manner - Parking is a problem and half of our traffic is people driving in circles - and YeS, we all know around Lemon and Main there is plenty of parking in lots but that is really not the case on Palm, upper Main, Burns Court, Pineapple avenue and many other little areas.
Interesting posts last night. Thanks to whoever posted "Beam me up", I laughed out loud when I read that one. "Beam me down to the Hollywood 20, put me just PAST the ticket taker." Very creative thinking there.
As far as whether I was a big or little "Cheese" in Collier County, the last six years or so I was there I was Assistant County Manager, I also ran the Utility Finance Department and then the whole utility system for a while when it needed some help, was Budget Officer for five years, did a turn with Emergency Services, and ran the transportation system for a time when the road-building program went off the rails a bit. I don't know what kind of cheese that makes me, you decide. If you're suggesting that Collier's housing issues have my fingerprints on them, and now I'm bringing them here, that's a stretch, not to mention a monumental overstatement of my influence on Collier County. Collier's housing issues are similar at this point to Sarasota's, probably more severe, but have evolved in very different ways. I wonder if traffic congestion on I-75 between Naples and Ft. Myers hadn't reached epic proportions whether affordability concerns there would be as high as they are. The community's consciousness about the issue in the 90's there was very different than here, now. I will say this about Collier - a community doesn't face the housing issues they have, driven by property values, because it's been poorly planned, run, or developed. (Teh quality of the raod median landscaping, for example, is something that contributes to high values.) I think many thousands of both public and private sector people who had a hand in that place through the peak of its growth in the 80's and 90's would make no apology for the work that was done there, myself included.
There is certainly some truth to what has been labeled so far the "laziness" factor downtown, but I see it more as our natural tendency as humans to resist changes to our routines. I have to agree with the poster who said they were always able to find a parking space, for example the county lots off Ringling are always available in the evening and never full. But if you've been driving downtown for 10 or 20 years and always pulled in right down the block from where you wanted to go, this seems like a great inconvenience. But of course you could do that 10 years ago because you were the only customer.
As far as what was written in the paper yesterday, I'm sure their version of events was precisely correct in every detail, and told the full and complete story of what happened. Nonetheless, I will wait until a thorough inquiry has been completed before I make any comments. As far as selectively editing the blog based on whether the victim of criticism is is supportive of me, that's just rubbish. If you want to write bile, why don't you start your own blog? You and your fellow mud-throwers can have a great time.
One more thought - I love the idea of "trial" periods, where we experiment with things like car-free zones downtown. I know the county bicycle programs have a bike to work day once a year, how many people downtown do you think we could get to participate in a bike or walk to work week? Enough to make a visible difference?
I would love to be able to ride my bike to work. The problem is rush hour traffic. If we can come up with ways for safe biking, I would be all for it.
Consideration for those who work downtown but who cannot afford to LIVE downtown should be addressed. What about people who can't walk for physical reasons? Or age? Consider our population - it is not a city made up of young people.
Key West also has the little trolley cars - golf carts - and so does Gasperilla Island. They seem to work. What about little bumper cars to park & ride? Would avoid injury due to accidents. (hee hee) Why can't city employees who drive city vehicles walk to work? and walk around the neighborhoods - like code enforcement? Practice what you preach. Cmr. Shelin rides his little - whatever its called - that's pretty neat. What about the others? I don't see them parking and riding to work or walking to City Hall or taking busses or taxis or whatever.
Golf cart idea Shawn & others mention sounds good. But then you have to stop traffic on Main St probably. No traffic, no parking lots required.
Suggest bus schedules be changed. right now people who ride busses and work 8-5 have to either be late to work or leave work early to catch the busses. Or get to work really early and leave really late. Some sensible schedules would help out. And why don't busses run on Sundays to the beaches? Not all people are off work on weekends.
Let Commissioners and City & county employees be the guinea pigs in the experiment. Why do everyday citizens, tourists and taxpayers have to be the experiment?
Monorails in the future would be nice from one end of downtown to the other. Still - where would employees park?
Anyone see the duck trolleys in Boston? Drives on streets then goes into the water for tours?
Good idea about City & County employees being the experiment. Its a captive group for you. If a concept will not work for them it probably will not work at all. A majority of city employees are over age 50. A lot have difficulty walking. Would be a good choice for guinea pigs for a project. Make them take busses or find other means of transportation to work for a week and see what happens. Commissioners also.
Pattie said:
City leaders & planning staff, etc., keep promoting this walk to town and walk around community, let's see if they can give up their cars for a week and walk to work or find other modes of transportation!
It would be really cool, and probably unrealistic, but we would be the first city to try it * close the city to traffic for one day * every street coming into the city blocked off * so you do have to find another way to work.....the only problem with that is we really do not have a good transportation system in place * is that a County thing?
People who really live in downtown really do walk around and do not always use their cars. It is just so darn hot most of the year and by the time you get someplace that is only three blocks away you are dehydrated and burned and unpleasantly stinky and wet.
Who was it that did not want arcades?
People who really live in downtown really do walk around and do not always use their cars. It is just so darn hot most of the year and by the time you get someplace that is only three blocks away you are dehydrated and burned and unpleasantly stinky and wet.
Who was it that did not want arcades?
People who really live in downtown really do walk around and do not always use their cars. It is just so darn hot most of the year and by the time you get someplace that is only three blocks away you are dehydrated and burned and unpleasantly stinky and wet.
Who was it that did not want arcades?
I love the bike rack idea with bikes to use around town! Can we trust most of them will stay and not be taken but maybe they can come from people giving them away and then who cares. Any liability issues? This should be looked into, great idea.
I think the newspaper and tv should challenge the city to see if their concepts of alternate modes of transportation and walking really work. First start with the planners and Commissioners and Administration and make them walk to work! For some that will be about 3- 35 miles I would guess. Ok to be late for work? Let's just see if the brains behind the program can make it work for them - I challenge you, Mr. McNees - see if the planning Dept can walk to work or find other ways - no cars - for a week.
To 3/29/06 who worked in NY and lived in PA, why don't you hop on 75 northbound and go back to where you came from. If we are so lazy in this little hick town, why are New Yorkers among the most obese people in the world? I also lived in NY for 3 years. 99 percent of the people that are walking up and down the street do so because they are forced to. You make it sound as if all those fat bodies just love strolling up and down Broadway as part of some fitness plan. I guess the only reason NY has all those miles of subways, rails, and thousands of cabs and buses is because there is just not enough room on the sidewalks for all those fitness buffs. Thanks for making me laugh today pal, you're the best. Yee Hah!
The spirit of some sort of trial periods would be to see if we could get the community engaged in the effort to have fewer cars downtown, to make anyone "guinea pigs." If people were hired with the understanding that they would have to walk to work that would be one thing, but I don't see what would be served by asking someone to walk 35 miles to work.
The bicycle program I was aware of took donated or often abandoned bikes and painted them all the same color. There wasn't much motivation to steal them, they were there to use anyway, and if I remember right they were painted sort of an army green so they were recognizable. I'll have to dig that one up.
This is an interesting discussion - can we keep the name calling out of it, or does our collective emotional maturity level not allow for that? I believe it does.
Actually, New York is a forerunner in alternative transportation. Subways, rails, buses, cabs. Another reason people are walking is because its a City that has achieved the balance of what is required for "live-work" centeredness. There are a number of communities looking at options, some as a part of a TDM and others to tie into sustainable approaches, such as reducing the carbon footprint.
Maybe Sarasota isn't quite at a stage where we can label ourselves a pedestrian friendly
city. The balance required for a viable inner core is far from ready. However, what is wrong with looking at the future, requesting comments from its citizens and taking them for what they are worth. You know, public private partnerships, sometimes grant funding, etc. can come out of brainstorming and networking.
What would it hurt for city employees to experiment for one day or a week with this concept of walking or alternate modes of transportation for those who live within a reasonable distance - 1 or 2 miles?
Walk from police dept to City Hall - otherwise where, exactly, are people supposed to walk? The nearest pharmacy is Walgreens. Nearest "real" grocery store is Publix at Ringling or at 10th St in the future. No doctor offices within walking distance.
Actually, I like the Boston ducks. Really, take one, class it up to Sarasota style, use it to go across town and by water to Longboat or City Island where people could park. From downtown to Island Park and Van Wezel. It would be a fun ride too.
http://www.bostonducktours.com/duck_history_main.html
Check out above website for info on the ducks. They are unique, cute, move people on water and land. - and could be painted purple to match Van Wezel!
http://www.bostonducktours.com/about_gallery_01.html
better pictures - and they have purple ones!
I think the public transportation ideas are good to have even if we don't have the same demand for them as a New York City. I never have a problem finding a parking spot either, but I would still ride a cool little people mover just 'cause I think they are fun. Maybe I am lazy also, I don't know. After all, this is a touristy town, and those kinds of cheeky transports are all part of the fun. Not to mention that some of our people walking around are a little on the old side, and might welcome a little help getting from one end of Main to the other.
The reality is for many who live downtown is that it is just too hot to walk all the time. It is easy to say walk in this weather because it is beautiful and not too hot but the majority of our days in Florida is well above the comfort zone. So, many do not like to walk much more than one or possibly two blocks before it is somewhat decided against. We either want to drive or we may not even go, the not go version hurts businesses that need us to get out and patronize our city.
And I am a very fit person!!
So, how do we get around all of us that want to get around? I love the ideas of smaller vehicles or the bicycle thing.
I'm reminded of a vendor who approached the City of Naples sometime in the late 80's or early 90's wanting to operate an amphibious vehicle a lot like the ducks - I think it was called the "Buquebus" or something like that, if I'm not mistaken it was of European origin. Well at that time the people of Naples didn't want to see those funny looking vehicles on their streets, so the vendor was ultimately run off, but it sure was a lively discussion that captivated the city for a time. I'm a little surprised such a thing hasn't been proposed by someone here already.
Some cute motor vehicles that can move people around and could be less expensive than a car - something like go-carts or rickshaws. I also really like the bike idea and we could paint then a really cool bright color so they stand out.
How about those carts they drive in airports? The ones with the annoying beeping sound. They fit several people and could run all over sarasota. Are they legal on streets?
While this is a great concept, is it a surprise to anyone that this city begins discussing it AFTER it's approved the projects that are going to flood downtown with more vehicles? AFTER it gives land to projects without requiring enough parking be included (by it's own consultants estimates)?
And of course no major discussion has occurred regarding what this traffic will do to surrounding neighborhoods where high volumes and high speeds have never been adequately addressed.
How about a little foresight? How about a little vision beyond the first-step impact and out into the nearby communities? How about slowing down enough to actually see what the impact of the many ongoing projects is before approving more and bigger ones?
For those that seem to underestimate the citizens and government of Sarasota and want to find fault in everything only showing themselves as clueless:
The city has had a Mobility Study done several years ago but the city commissioners did not want to make the difficult decisions recommended by staff and DOT. One of those decisions would be to reroute 41 around the north side of our city, possibly up by University. Or course the Longboat Key residents had a hissy fit when we wanted to two lane the bayfront, now coming from an island that is only two lanes for an eleven mile stretch is somewhat puzzling but they prevailed with our city commissioners. SO my point is the city and involved citizens have been working on this issue for years.
There has also been a Master Parking Plan done with citizens and the city. So, while staff has presented the needs the city commission has not fully embraced the recommendations or carried out the jobs to be done. Instead the commission has given away state street that could have served as a very useful location for a parking garage - it is anyones guess how many cars the garage could have held - 800, 900 or 1000? would have been a great location for a park and ride on trolley or go cart spot.
Lastly, our city wants people to live in it and enjoy all it has to offer which is way more than any other small city I know of. All these cars you mention may be parked while our residents move about on their feet or in a small trolley or something we are trying to figure out. Do you have any suggestions?
So, for those that want to slam someone, slam yourself instead for just trying to act as if no work is being done down at city hall.
If you understand the philosophy of downtown redevelopment it is based on the premise that higher density of both residents and commercial lessens the need to drive in the first place. And you are correct, there are many pieces of that still need to be put in place. You might be interested in an "origins and destinations" study that was done recently on city traffic. Our traffic problems really have little to do with increasing density downtown, rather with the region's trafffic passing through.
"High volumes and high speeds have never been adequately addressed" - I think this is a driver behavior issue, not a downtown development issue. One thing I always point out when I'm visiting in a neighborhood and speeding or "cut-through" traffic is an issue is that we all do it to each other - meaning that when I'm in your neighborhood I'm "cut-through traffic," and we are a shortcut-seeking people. Speeding in neighborhoods is also something we do to ourselves, tourists aren't inclined to be zooming through on side streets. So this is a behavioral issue we all own a piece of, and our SPD traffic units stay very busy doing their part.
If there is interest in a "trial" period how about raising the bar and asking not only the citizens and workers downtown to participate but asking some organizations or manufacturers to participate. The MPO, some New Urbanist organizations, (if
Duany recommends a "walking" City offer him the opportunity to participate and offer suggestions), NACO, NLC, DEP, FLDOT, ICMA, Smart Growth Communities, developers, architects and engineers, alternatively fueled vehicle manufacturers, Segway operators, Bicycle rental companies, marinas, boat rental operators,parking operators, taxi companies, SCAT, etc. Then, consider including it as a part of a City Forum or workshop to see what happened, what type of reduction may have occurred, what is feasible and what may not be. Remember, this could have more benefit to the community than just eliminating congestion and parking issues. This can address the environment, safety, future planning, etc. Although we are talking local, with the interest in the above issues nationally you might set yourself up as a trial community from which others could gain perspctive as well and encourage participation by publishing your results in some of the national governmental publications.
I am not sure it is a good idea to do away with cars in the city and never really felt like we ever had a huge congestion problem anyway except in a few key spots.
Maybe people riding segways or mopeds get a designated parking spot that is really conveniently located, encouraging smaller transportation downtown. I really love seeing our commissioner riding his segway - very cool.
An elderly population is the key word. Walking works in Boston, NYC, other large cities that are not retirement towns like this one. Go the the Farmer's Market to get a true picture of the age here. Nothing wrong with it, it is just a fact.
Mr. Clark - Just a quick note about the crosswalk signals, because I think they are widely misunderstood. On our major thoroughfares we don't have "on demand" crosswalk signals. That means that pushing the button doesn't actually activate the signal change to allow for you to cross; what it does is tell the signal controller to allow for a longer duration for your crossing phase. So if it feels to you like the light doesn't change any more quickly if you push the button, you are correct in that feeling. (A bit like the elevator not coming more quickly no matter how many times I push that button.) I'm not saying this is the only way it can be, just the way the system works now. In fact this is probably a good example of how our systems are weighted today in favor of moving the CARS first.
Speeding traffic and high volumes are behaviors. But they are behaviors that can be managed with stop signs, speed tables and managed road widths.
Anyone who has seen the dozens of cars backed up on Ringling Blvd. in the morning rush can attest to the fallacy of 'regional' traffic being the culprit in at least one specifc case.
And the mere fact that hundreds more citizens will be passing out through neighborhoods without any other changes in place indicates that increasing density downtown would indeed cause a problem. Ignoring it for now (those people WILL leave downtown, some several times in a day...not to mention more people heading in to service them).
And for the anonymous city staffer throwing words like 'clueless' around? Chill. The city 'acts' as a whole, and is often referred to as such. The 'city' has not worked on Payne Park, though I know planning has been done. Doesn't mean I'm not disgusted with the 'city' for it not being done. It's nothing personal against any single person.
The city has not worked on Payne Park - what do you call purchasing the land, clearing the land for a park, building a skate park, providing parking, creating a vision....they have done not work? Still "get a clue". And have you told staff how to get the money to do all the things you feel should be done, I am sure they would like to know if a money tree is already on site.
The idea that seems the most realistic to implement now is the FREE BIKE Thing. Let's get it started!! Contact the associations downtown in the different areas and find the bike locations and let's do it.
Payne Park - I will add that the first phase of the Payne Park construction, which will do all of the basic infrastructure, create the "great lawn", walking and jogging trails, park lighting, restrooms, skate park building and the installation of 400 trees, is funded and construction should be underway this summer.
At least one anonymous city staffer (from their comments they would have to be) seems to have it wrong. A skate park isn't the community's Payne Park, nor is parking for skaters a Park. Weeds and a shell path do not a park make, either. Planning was acknowledged originally. If these few things are what this staffer considers that 'work' done by the city to this point to make up for not having a Park for all the years it's been vacant, well...it speaks for itself.
And the city didnt buy the land for the Park Mr or Ms Clueless and Angry City Staffer. It was a gift.
Every time someone is less than happy about a situation in the city, they've got to come up with a funding solution before they can comment? Please, Sarasota has money to do projects annually, the question is only which ones. And Payne Park has been neglected on that list, those in nearby neighborhoods feel it's because we're too poor to be the chosen downtown folks and too rich to be given handouts.
And Mr. McNees, thanks for the Payne Park update, it's long overdue and will be much appreciated by nearby neighborhoods.
One suggestion if I may...
Nearby neighborhoods often have poor or no easy sidewalk access to get to the park without cutting through the Publix parking lot or empty lots on School. Might be something to review once work gets underway.
What happened to the trolleys we used to have? Can they temporarily get a route going downtown now that we have more people visiting it now?
One could do the route up Main to 301 and then down Ringling to Palm and then up main and on and on.
Another could go down Orange and then back up Pineapple around the Library back to Orange and on and on and on.
Has anyone been looking into a compact system for our downtown with the trolleys that will actually work aside from the routes of the past? Going out to St. Armands just makes the time between getting back on the trolley too long. St. Armands should have it's own trolley system since most people head out there to shop and not many go from there to Downtown to shop.
I've lived in Dallas, Atlanta and Indianapolis. I've worked in 40 or so cities of all size. Only in those few (NYC, San Fran, Boston) with truly extensive networks of transit is mass transit effective.
A downtown-only plan is doomed to fail, as it has in the past. People will still drive to the core, people will drive from the core, and people will drive anything more than a few block across it.
So the only option is frequent- and convenient-enough service that walking to their car is almost harder...with enough depth of destinations (in and out of the core), that it becomes second-nature to use.
None of the ideas of special days, car free zones, etc. address the overall issue of transporation or parking. Band-aids do not solve the problem. Sarasota's SCAT system that ends at 6PM, doesn't run on Sunday and does not run on a grid system and requires all kinds of transfers to get anywhere needs lots of improvement. Someone talked about living in PA and commuting to NYC. Try to commute to Sarasota w/o a car. Yes, it will need subsidies. But every car those subsidies takes off the roads also helps the affordable housing problem and our clogged road problem. If someone doesn't need a car, housing is more affordable even at a higher price. We need commuter/kiss-and-ride lots so a one-car family can use the bus.
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